Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Craft

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Quickfire
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

Chopper wrote:IIRC RAF types have been serving in NZ on the P-3k's to keep provide training until the Nimrods are replaced. Pretty good mothballing carriers and surveillance aircraft before replacing them. I'd imagine the rational is the cost of maintaining obsolete equipment can be poured into the purchase of said vapourware.

The P-3's are an incredible aircraft, like the A-4, UH-1 and the C-130 they will outlast religion.
Procurement is not a logical process. Scrap the capability you have in order to buy something twice as expensive for a bigger kickback. Or, create a process that hides that while pretending that just in time delivery is a concept that collapses space and time into post-modern logistical certainty. What they don't mention is that zero capability means potentially exponential costs in the interim.

But if you're a UK defense advisor with a foreign passport on the payroll of a foreign defence company fixated on terminating or torturing goat herders at the highest possible price then capability is not the issue, the size of your 'fee' is. Nor does the real world interfere with risk mitigation strategies as target practice takes place in a desert far, far from your Aston Slingback and 18th hole.
paul463 wrote:I believe a replacement Maritime recon aircraft will be announced during the 2015 defence review. It is complete bollocks just now.
463 gets the last word.

When the RAF were told to look for a lost yacht this summer they had to fly Spain-Azores-Atlantic in a C130 with people scanning the horizon from the cockpit with binos. No wonder they don't get (t)asked to go out in the Atlantic much. Home in time for tea it is then.

And, by the way, that scheissheap mono-ELINT crap-u-like scheissbag third-hand KC130 or whatever the wretched thing is does 20% of what the Nimrod did, and mainly still in US colours, or, at least it did so at least until recently. Was never required after the flawed Nimrod upgrades. But they were scrapped after being upgraded. So it was all a fiddle somewhere along the line.

:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Chopper »

I figured that would be the case, Herr Mueler. I was reading up on the NZ P3-K2's and it looks like they are planned to be in service till 2050. Wouldn't surprise me, given their history. NZ has the largest maritime patrol region on earth, so even without a fighter wing, we need the P3's or something. I wonder if we are charging the Poms for training? ;-)

Jag's out of mothballs? Maybe they are being sold, like NZ's Skyhawks. If the shizen does hit the turbo fan I guess NZ might gets its fighter capability back. Middle East is a lost cause and the rooskies fighting over world banks and all.
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

Chopper wrote:I figured that would be the case, Herr Mueler. I was reading up on the NZ P3-K2's and it looks like they are planned to be in service till 2050. Wouldn't surprise me, given their history. NZ has the largest maritime patrol region on earth, so even without a fighter wing, we need the P3's or something. I wonder if we are charging the Poms for training? ;-)

Jag's out of mothballs? Maybe they are being sold, like NZ's Skyhawks. If the shizen does hit the turbo fan I guess NZ might gets its fighter capability back. Middle East is a lost cause and the rooskies fighting over world banks and all.
P3s are all well and good and part of the mix but you need something like an A340 with EW-ELINT-ASW-AS-C4I-SAR capabilities and an internal weapons bay ready for any type of threat somewhere in the middle of the Atlantic after more than twelve hours on patrol and relying on external tanks let alone a tanker to get home. Plus such platforms need even longer range anti-ship missiles to coordinate with satellites monitoring IR signatures. And with modern radars you can upgrade such a plane into a JSTARS platform, that is what the Russians are doing now to ensure multi-role capabilities.

Although flawed, the Nimrod could do all of that and drop sonar buoys or liferafts as necessary while also mounting Sidewinders (not sure how effective they would have been) and Shrike/ALARM missiles as nec. UK doesn't even have either of them now.

Jags- All the last UK Jags should have been liquidated in Spring 2005 and 2007. But - Oman's last four Jags were retired in August this year, those were the recent retirees was thinking of earlier.

:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by paul463 »

Quickfire wrote:
paul463 wrote:As an aside three Jaguars have appeared on the pan at Cosford, out of moth balls?????
:shock:

WHAT?

Are they French? (serious question...)

Someone just retired their last ones recently. UK ones in bits from years ago would have been pulped (like current Tornado F3 scrapheap) by now post McKinsey defence procurement non-reviews.

MAybe they got ex-pilots to use soon-to-be-scrapped ex-French (or Francophone) Jags as a stop gap for the non-Tornado strike fleet (copyright newsnight).

:quick:
They look UK in colour and markings, perhaps just for the museum at Cosford. Although there are loads of aircraft in storage at Shawbury
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by paul463 »

Quickfire wrote:
Chopper wrote:IIRC RAF types have been serving in NZ on the P-3k's to keep provide training until the Nimrods are replaced. Pretty good mothballing carriers and surveillance aircraft before replacing them. I'd imagine the rational is the cost of maintaining obsolete equipment can be poured into the purchase of said vapourware.

The P-3's are an incredible aircraft, like the A-4, UH-1 and the C-130 they will outlast religion.
Procurement is not a logical process. Scrap the capability you have in order to buy something twice as expensive for a bigger kickback. Or, create a process that hides that while pretending that just in time delivery is a concept that collapses space and time into post-modern logistical certainty. What they don't mention is that zero capability means potentially exponential costs in the interim.

But if you're a UK defense advisor with a foreign passport on the payroll of a foreign defence company fixated on terminating or torturing goat herders at the highest possible price then capability is not the issue, the size of your 'fee' is. Nor does the real world interfere with risk mitigation strategies as target practice takes place in a desert far, far from your Aston Slingback and 18th hole.
paul463 wrote:I believe a replacement Maritime recon aircraft will be announced during the 2015 defence review. It is complete bollocks just now.
463 gets the last word.

When the RAF were told to look for a lost yacht this summer they had to fly Spain-Azores-Atlantic in a C130 with people scanning the horizon from the cockpit with binos. No wonder they don't get (t)asked to go out in the Atlantic much. Home in time for tea it is then.

And, by the way, that scheissheap mono-ELINT crap-u-like scheissbag third-hand KC130 or whatever the wretched thing is does 20% of what the Nimrod did, and mainly still in US colours, or, at least it did so at least until recently. Was never required after the flawed Nimrod upgrades. But they were scrapped after being upgraded. So it was all a fiddle somewhere along the line.

:quick:
Ah you mean the Rivet Joint! Lovely looking AC!
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

paul463 wrote:
Ah you mean the Rivet Joint! Lovely looking AC!
Yeah, RC-135, cutting edge in 1962 when it supported Kennedy's spec ops in SE Asia, that all turned out well for everyone...

To think we actually had to pay hard cash for retrograde Americana... Humiliating.

Noone left with teh cojones to haul that junk out of the Boneyard in Arizona for free either.

Whoever got a kickback on that deal was a bottom-feeding noob.

:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

paul463 wrote:They look UK in colour and markings, perhaps just for the museum at Cosford. Although there are loads of aircraft in storage at Shawbury
Hmmm ... Seems like some kind of emergency un-mothballing. Who'd get three out for an airshow or a private run-out?

All seems more akin to getting HMS Bulwark out of the scrapyard in 82.

:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

Thundershot wrote:

Superb vids Tshot, einfach klasse. Great walk down memory lane.

:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

Ukraine testing out new 'Varan' camo pattern. :thumbsup:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Meanwhile, Ukrainian volunteers trying to bump Russians from the top of a Donbas colliery with a PTRD and RPD support



:quick:
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Re: Operation Bloodhound - Red Shadow Air Cushion Landing Cr

Post by Quickfire »

Russian propaganda channel filming Donetsk airport c. 3rd December not long after recovery of terminated RF Vympel SF and another ceasefire due to fall into place later that day ... but never happened.



:quick:
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